Posted: 1:48 pm Friday, March 14th, 2014

Georgia Tech’s Paul Johnson: Recruiting has changed in Atlanta 

By Michael Carvell

Georgia Tech’s Paul Johnson has seen a lot of changes in recruiting over the last 10 years in the state of Georgia, particularly in the Atlanta area.

The state has transformed into one of the nation’s hotbeds for college football talent, producing around 215-230 high school seniors per year to sign with FBS schools.

Georgia Tech's Paul Johnson (AP Photo/Luis M. Alvarez)

Georgia Tech’s Paul Johnson (AP Photo/Luis M. Alvarez)

Georgia is considered the fourth-best talent base in the country, behind California, Florida, and Texas. And because of that, everybody wants in.

And one reason a lot of out-of-state schools have recruiting success in Atlanta is this: An ever-growing population with no longtime connections to either Georgia Tech or UGA. Families often move to the area for employment opportunities.

“There’s a lot of transition — Atlanta is a transition area,” Johnson told the AJC. “A lot of people move in and move out. I think the recruiting is different because you have so many more people in here recruiting.

“I don’t ever remember it being like this when I was at Georgia Southern. Or even when I first started when I was here, you didn’t have all the Big 10 around. Now you’ve got even Big 12 schools recruiting in here, and the Pac-12 in here – all five of the major conferences. All the other conferences are in here as well.

“It gets pretty saturated.”

Due to the heavy competition, Georgia Tech (and UGA) has expanded its recruiting efforts across the East Coast. More than half of the team’s 2014 football signees were from out of state. Out of the 10 local products from Georgia, all 10 were from the Atlanta area or close to it.

THE LATEST RECRUITING NEWS

SOME OF YOUR RECENT FAVORITES

TO GET THE BIG PICTURE

Got an item? mcarvell@ajc.com

mcarvell@ajc.com

– By Michael Carvell, AJC’s Recruiting Blog

Note: Inappropriate BLOG comments and personal attacks will NOT be tolerated. We love the lively discussions but hate-filled, harassing and irresponsible comments are unacceptable.

Please Follow me on Twitter @RecruitingAJC + Please be my Facebook friend here

137 comments
hotsaus
hotsaus

Tech fans, please come to the realization that your recent difficulties on the football field are more to blame on a head coach you runs an antiquated system no high school football player worth their salt wants to play in, you cannot recruit because your coach has the personality of a grizzly bear, because your administation is inept overall at achieving success at the athletic level and because your fan base continually ACCEPTS the excuse of academics as a mulligan for mediocracy.

Get yourself a real coach, demand changes at the athletic administration level and quit covering your football failures on the flawed notion that academics prevents this (IT DOES NOT!). I have provided you a list of schools with higher academic requirements (engineering or not) who have struck the right balance, you can too once you accept reality and start holding your administration accountable.

hotsaus
hotsaus

GT Joe - Why does everything have to revert back to UGA? As an objective observer, I have come to two conclusions about Techies:

1. They are convinced and act like their school is Ivy league quality

2. They are completely obsessed with all things UGA (this is obvious to any outsider now living in Atlanta)

I was the one who introduced academic rankings into this thread as a baseline to how other schools with higher academic requirements, entrance qualifications and curriculum standards than Tech have consistently achieved higher success on the football field. Not ONCE did I compare Tech to an SEC school or Georgia for that matter. But of course, every Techie's obessession with UGA reverts any converstation back to that.

My point being is that Tech should not accept athletic mediocracy on the false belief that there academic standards are preventing them from further success. My comparison to these other schools is completely relevant in that entrance requirements, curriculum requirements, etc are higher than Tech's, regardless if Tech focuses on Engineering. Last time I checked Tech has many other majors (i.e. business for example).

GTJoe
GTJoe

hotsaus:  how on earth you think that comparing an engineering school to a Vandy or Stanford or Wake or UNC is beyond me.  Only one of those schools you listed has a better engineering school than Tech (Stanford is probably the best all-around university in the country).


Are you a UGA grad?  If so, your silliness makes sense.  No longer comparing tech to Auburn or Alabama?  That's what I thought.  We are a specialty school.  We have 34 majors.  Stanford and UGA have 200+.  Comparing an engineering school with 90+%  students in STEM to a true "university" is moronic, just like the US News editors.  Compare apples to apples, compare the schools of engineering.


Let me educate you a lil bit:  did you even look at the methodology of the rankings you cited?  Didn't think so.  22.5% of the ranking is retention rate/grad rate.  GT has a SIX year grad rate of 79%, no school has anything remotely close in the top 36, hence our low ranking.  Why this has any bearing on what makes a school "reputable" is beyond me.  All those schools you listed have 90+% grad rates, some at 97%.


If only 79% of students graduate, that should tell you how difficult the school would be for student-athletes who must meet lower academic standards to get in.  Which should also tell you how hard it is for tech to compete with diploma factories like UGA when we have to meet the 50% APR.

hotsaus
hotsaus

The #36 national academic ranking is very extremely relevant in this conversation. I introduced the ranking to inject a bit of reality into every Techie's mind on how their perceived school of higher learning prevents them from achieving academic success. Here are schools that are ranked higher than Tech academically, and I am sure they have a multitude of Top 5 programs within their educational offerings:

-Stanford (5), Duke (7), Northwestern (12), Vanderbilt (17), Notre Dame (18), USC (23), Virginia (23), Wake Forest (23), Michigan (28), UNC (32).

To compare Tech to these schools, especially the Top 20, would indeed be an insult to these schools. In terms of comparing apples to apples, Tech is the 5thranked academic school in its OWN CONFERENCE! By your excuse of academics preventing football success, Tech enters each ACC season with a competitive advantage due to its inferior academics relative to its conference counterparts!

While Tech has engineering programs in the Top10, Stanford is a Top 5 school and a perennial BCS power and Notre Dame/USC have been in the National Title hunt many times over the past decade. So Techies, these are TRUE academic powerhouses who don't use the pathethic excuse of an inflated notion of academic prowess to explain their suckitude in the football field. Keep in mind that less than 5% of Tech football players have an engineering major so there goes that excuse GTJoe.

GTJoe
GTJoe

By NCAA rules, a team that does not meet an Academic Progress Rate of 925 will be penalized.  925 equates to 50% graduation rate.


Achieving a 50% graduate rate at Tech is harder than at UGA or any other SEC school.  As a result, we do not compete (or recruit) on a level playing ground.


Translation for dwag fans:  If Billy must mop 10 aisles at Wal-Mart and Bobby must mop 8 aisles at Wal-Mart, Billy is at a "disadvantage" if they are racing to get the last Bear Claw in the snack machine after work.

GTJoe
GTJoe

hotsaus and ellemenop:


"Georgia Tech is an outstanding institute of higher learning.  So is UGA.  And Auburn, Alabama, Clemson, Duke, Florida, South Carolina, Virginia, etc.  "


Putting tech in that category (aside from Duke) is insulting and shows your general ignorance of the school.  Bringing up a #36 ranking by US News is also very telling.  Let me educate you:


GT is an engineering school, so compare apples to apples.  Recently ranked #9 engineering school IN THE WORLD.  Top 5 in the US.  Average SAT score last year:  1420/1600.  And ranked #1 public school in Return on Investment.


Comparing UGa or any other SEC school to Tech is silly.  If not for the Hope Scholarship, UGA would be Auburn (like it used to be).  Nobody smart goes to UGA unless they have a full ride.

mgt87
mgt87

pj's recruiting hasn't changed.  good and consistent.

Cupofjoe
Cupofjoe

Ga Tech has always been a tough academic institution.  It was tough during the Dodd, Ross, and O'leary era.  It was tough during the early Cremins era.


Tech has become largely irrelevant athletically because of its coaching.  UGA has the state Ga. Tech should be Atlanta's (college) team.  



DawgNole
DawgNole

GTBob: "What is the reason that GT has recruited poorly for so long then? If it is not related to academics at all like several past coaches and AD's have eluded to then what is the reason? Indulge us with your wizardly knowledge."


GTBob: ". . . Do you think with our talent level that we had 100% zero chance of even competing with either one of them?" 

__________________________


AD's have "eluded" to . . .???

Had "100% zero chance" . . .???

Clearly, those tough GT academics flew WAY over your head.



BigTimeJacketFan
BigTimeJacketFan

Think we have an early enrollee from Lowndes County - nowhere near Atlanta.  


Agree with folks - this is no excuse for Johnson.  We should at least be able to get defensive players that match up with everybody else.

HarveyPooka
HarveyPooka

Comments such as this headline just serve to reinforce how important it is / will be to hire competent, full time recruiters who can ascend to and stay on top of the game.

Quackmeyer
Quackmeyer

Supersize.........MIT does play football.  Don't know why, but they do.  See their scores in the paper every Sunday.

AdmiralObvious53
AdmiralObvious53

Atlanta is full of transplants!  Who knew!  Thanks PJ for that insight and the latest excuse for your failures!  Give Paul Johnson a lifetime contract!

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus You provided a list of schools that have struck the right balance?  Let's see:  Northwestern?  garbage football.  Wake?  awful football in general.  Duke?  1 year wonder.  UVA?  lousy football.  UNC?  we own them in football.  Michigan and ND?  put it this way, we haven't missed a bowl in 17 years.  They have.


What tech has done in football, despite the academic hurdles (few majors, difficult school), is pretty amazing.  And what CPJ has done with the "antiquated" offense is unprecedented in decades of GT football.


Class is over.

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus blame the head coach?  blame the offensive system?  Then explain to me why Gailey (a pro coach with a pro style offense) couldn't recruit any better, even when allowed to bring in academic special admits (as evidenced by Gailey's <50% grad rate in 2008)?


As an outsider, it's obvious that you don't understand Tech; 32% of kids graduate in 4 years.  in the 90s, 33% of freshman didn't make it to their SECOND year.  It's a hard school.  Harder to graduate from than Stanford and every school you list (yeah I said it, lower grad rates bear this out).


CPJ must meet NCAA graduation guidelines (namely 50% grad rates); the harder the school, the harder it is to meet this.


Even an intellectually challenged person like yourself can surely grasp that concept.

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus 1.  Ivy league quality?  Let's put it this way:  no ivy league school has a better engineering school.  NONE.  If your school was top 10 IN THE WORLD in ANYTHING, then you can brag too.

2.  If you don't realize that UGA is our chief rival, then you haven't lived in Atlanta long enough.


You introduced academic rankings (showing your ignorance, btw); tech doesn't compare to "national universities" because it isn't a "university".  It's a specialty school.  Your ranking is garbage because it compares apples to oranges; it uses retention rates and class size as measures for goodness sakes!


Act like you have a decent education and look at the facts.

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus Stanford a perennial BCS power?  LOL, did you just start watching CFB when you moved to Atlanta?  Stanford was a perennial doormat FOR DECADES until 2009.  Before that, 7 straight losing seasons.  simp.

Classof98
Classof98

@GTJoe  Do they give Master's Degrees in Excuse Making at Tech?


12 out of 13, nerd.

MikeBanning
MikeBanning

@GTJoe  

Very few of the FB players that are in the 2-deep depth chart and actually play in games are majoring in Engineering.

Having a BS in Business Admin program located on a campus with a highly ranked Engr. College doesn't guarantee that those BUSINESS classes will be harder.

At last count we had 3 or 4 out of our top 44 players that were Engr. majors.

We have a team made up of Business Majors and similar degrees, we don't have a ton of different degrees, but we can field a lot better team than we can by recruiting better players that can graduate in Business.

My main issue is if we are limited by degree offerings, then WHY would the the GTAA limit GT FB even further by hiring a HC that is both a curmudgeon and a crappy recruiter, and runs a gimmicky offense that talented recruits hate.

No matter how much GT alums like you brag about our academics, the fact is we with CPJ as our HC NEVER would have signed Andrew Luck.

What many GT fans forget, is that the really smart FB Recruits want to play in the NFL also!

GTJoe
GTJoe

@Cupofjoe Yes, always a tough institution; but not ALWAYS a tough institution for athletes.  Today it is.


I would refer you to the AJC article where CPJ discusses "special admits", i.e., kids who didn't meet Tech's admission standards for athletes but still got in. Before CPJ, Gailey, OLeary could get just about anyone, JUCOs, etc., as long as they met NCAA admission standardsd (which is basically reading and writing your name), and the graduation rates were horrendous.  CPJ had a 20% limit on special admits until this last recruiting class.


So complain all you want about his recruiting, but he has been hamstrung unlike Gailey.  And still recruited on par with Gailey.  Facts are facts.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole Really, thats the best comeback you have? It really bugs you that you aren't capable of arguing football related matters with me doesn't it?

SupersizeThatOrder-mutt
SupersizeThatOrder-mutt

@Quackmeyer  

I stand corrected.  Do they play league football or  club football?  I know they are not an FBS or FCS school; at what level do they play?

hotsaus
hotsaus

@GTJoe  GTJoe - why the personal shots? All I am doing is introducing objecive facts to the thread in contrast to your subjective spew of biased information.

According to your logic, one can disregard a school's holistic educational standards when ranking the merits of the school. Georgia Tech has a strong engineering program however that alone do not make it an academic power, hence the rankings from US News and numerous other reputable sources I have not referenced. Tech is usually ranked in the 30s.

pdmorgs
pdmorgs

@GTJoe @hotsaus I believe you have this all wrong.  Our run offense is exciting when we have the right spark plug at QB.  As far as PJ goes, he is a quality coach period.  You don't like him, OK.  I love he.  I remember when Tech played USC in the Sun bowl, on the USC side was a coach who showed no emotion and hid himself in his hoodie.  Paul Johnson was very emotional and was all over the field.  I like this in a coach.

I don't know if you are a Tech supporter or not, I am!

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus One more thing hotsaus:  you say that these other schools have "higher requirements" than tech?  That doesn't mean they are tougher schools than tech.  once again, you like to compare apples to oranges.  4 year grad rate from tech is 32%.


And yes, we have business major.  Average SAT in the undergrad b-school: 1302.  Do you think football players fit in with these students on average?

hotsaus
hotsaus

@GTJoe @hotsaus Three straight BCS Bowl apperances = perennial BCS power. Thats according to my book and most people as well.

POAD2013
POAD2013

@Classof98 Well they Do in Athens for UGa fans. We been hearing the same one over and over for 33 years.

GTJoe
GTJoe

@MikeBanning @GTJoe Average SAT score at GT undergrad b-school:  1302.  yeah, easy school.  Those football players fit right in!

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus @GTJoe Yes hotsaus, tech is a "one trick pony".  A world-renowned engineering school (since you aren't in engineering, you wouldn't know) that also happens to have a very good business school (top 30).  We are NOT a University.  Glad you agree, so now you should understand why we can't be compared to other "universities".


And please let me know which school at UGA is top 5 or 10 by US news; school of Engineering, school of business, school of medicine, school of liberal arts?  which school?  Not "which major", because tech has many majors that are top 5, and some that are #1 (like industrial engineering).


Keep comparing us to Stanford; we've had better football seasons than Stanford probably every year in the past 20 except for 3 years. 


Are you new to college football?

hotsaus
hotsaus

@GTJoe One more thing...according to your logic in bestowing academic prestige, if this approach were applied to football, then Georgia Tech football would deserve a top 5 ranking since they consistently finish in the Top 5 in rushing (yay, we do one thing well so we deserve a top ranking!!).  Unfortunately things dont work that way either on the football field or in academics.

hotsaus
hotsaus

@GTJoe

Numerous schools can lay claim to having a Top 5 ranking for a particular program, many of these true academic powers have Top 5 rankings in numerous programs. According to GTJoes logic, then the school he loves to hate down 316 is an academic power since it also has numerous programs ranked in the Top 5 and Top 10.

GT Joe - Tech is a one trick pony that does one thing well, this alone does not warrant it an academic power as evidenced by the numerous rankings out there....these rankings are objective and take a holistic/unbiased approach to rating a school, something you are incapable of doing.

I sense an awful lot of bravado for a school ranked #36 in the nation.

GTJoe
GTJoe

@hotsaus @GTJoe Perennial, by definition, means every year.  3 good years in the last 80 does not mean "perennial".

GTJoe
GTJoe

@MikeBanning Tech average SAT:  1420.  Tech b-school average SAT:  1302.


UGA average SAT:  1215.


Conclusion:  tech b-school has higher caliber students than all of UGA.  How can we compete with UGA?  add majors like "family finance" and "family and human development" and "pre-business" and "pre-journalism" and "housing" and "communication studies"  (real UGA football player majors, I can't make this stuff up).

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

"All" of my time? Why do you continue to lie? It's clearly not getting you anywhere.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole Yep, you spend all of your time on the AJC blogs checking the grammar of other posters and bashing people for making predictions that turn out to be wrong. Rarely do you ever offer any insight of your own. That is a sign of true courage

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

It doesn't require "courage" to make a fool of yourself, as you've clearly demonstrated. And I do "give" opinions--especially about fools.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole There was nothing foolish about my predictions. Picking LSU to beat UGA wasn't some wild stretch. You can't be right on all of them but at least I have the courage to give an opinion.

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

"All" of your posts? There you go, lying again. I archive selected posts of liars, narcissists, hypocrites, and fools. Nothing at all creepy about that. You fit the bill for all four.

And you're right, I don't make foolish predictions on blogs--like you do. I don't want to look foolish--like you do.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole Kinda of creepy that you have all of my posts archived so that you can use them in conversations later. Either way, if you think I have zero football knowledge because I got some predictions wrong then I would love to see an example of someone who does have football knowledge. Did you predict UGA to go 8-5 last year? If not then you must know nothing about football. You don't strike me as the type that even has the courage to make a public prediction though so who knows.

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

Checking "all" of your posts? There you go lying yet again. Don't flatter yourself.

Did I say you "attack" people? Nope. There you go lying yet again. 

You don't know what the truth is or you wouldn't continue to make a fool of yourself on here.

I've already shown you a few of your mindless predictions, which are as predictable as your hatred of all things UGA.

Get a life.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole Give me an example of the last time I attacked someone personally or made a mindless prediction. The truth is you are really bothered by me and my opinions about UGA football and the only way you feel that you can get back at me is by bringing up old predictions that turned out to be wrong or by checking all of my posts for grammar mistakes. It's kind of sad really.

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

What you see as "respectful" is actually a mean-spirited combo of condescension and arrogance, spiced with an unhealthy dose of exaggeration and distortion. Anyone who has followed your posts for more than a few moments can see that. 

I "bash" poor grammar only when the author is lying, ridiculing others, or making mindless predictions, as you often do. If you can't spell or write, you have zero credibility--and thus would do well to keep a low profile instead of sniping at UGA fans.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole I don't ridicule anyone who disagrees with me. Nor do I bash people for their grammar or question their knowledge if they picked a football game wrong. Im not sure where you are getting that from. I am pretty respectful on the blogs. Some just don't like some of my opinions.

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

Of course I get it. Again, what does that have to do with the fact that you can't spell or write even the most elementary English? Yet you're quick to ridicule anyone who disagrees with your worn-out, baseless, and fraudulent arguments about both UGA and GT. Who are you trying to fool, fool?

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole You still don't get it even after I explained it huh?Am I gonna have to start drawing diagrams?

DawgNole
DawgNole

@GTBob @DawgNole  

How is your pathetic inability to spell and write basic English "a little bit of a challenge and a little bit of a joke"? Pretty sad/ironic, actually, given the height of the pedestal on which you've placed yourself.

GTBob
GTBob

@DawgNole I said wizardly knowledge because his name is Gandolph and his avatar is the wizard Gandolph from the Lord of the Rings movies. It was a little bit of a challenge and a little bit of a joke at the same time. Sorry that it  went over your head. Ill try to remember that we have UGA fans in here and that some simple things might need better explanation.